107. Intuitive Healing Using Craniosacral Therapy by Etienne Peirsman, Teacher and Founder of Peirsman Cranio

Summary:

Etienne Peirsman shares his story of how he got into Cranial Sacral Therapy, which included his own experience of self-healing and a miraculous healing of a friend. He also discussed the importance of intuitive healing and the power of Cranial Sacral Therapy to diagnose and heal.

Etienne Peirsman discussed how stem cells are connected to the universal intelligence and don't think, but know what to do. He shares a story of a student and friend who were both paralyzed and were able to walk and talk again after a few craniosacral sessions. He also shares a story of a seven year old dyslexic boy who was able to read again after a few minutes of connecting to the life force.

Etienne Peirsman teaches people with no knowledge of the body how to access their intuition and use conscious touch to bring instant mindfulness. He also teaches an intensive program where students go through nine courses to learn cranial therapy and deal with their own issues. He guides them through the process and helps them access the life force and release emotions. He also has online courses available, which I definitely want to attend!

Check out his courses here:

www.peirsmancranio.com/course/basics

Etienne's Bio:

Highly inspirational and respected teacher in the field of CranioSacral, Etienne Peirsman came to Cranio in a non-traditional fashion. After a a staph infection left him with nearly 20% kidney function, he found that preparing to die brought him the clarity of total silence. In a remarkable turn of events, he was able to heal his own body, which led him to travel to the Osho International Meditation Center, where he was first introduced to Cranio, during an immersive meditation and bodywork training.

Etienne describes Cranio as the the closest thing to that wonderful silence he found during his near death experience, and from that time, 31 years ago, it became his life's passion.

His journey led him first to apprentice at the Upledger Institute in Florida, then teach at Bastyr University in Washington and the New Mexico Academy of Healing Arts. He is the founder of Peirsman Cranio as well as the CranioSacraal Therapie Academy in Holland, where he originated the CranioSacral Professional Organization and is an honorary member of The Dutch CranioSacral Practitioner Society.

Author of the pioneering book, "Craniosacral Therapy for Babies and Small Children" published by Penguin Random House, Etienne is about to publish his second book "Tantric Aspects of CranioSacral".

It is truly a unique experience to learn Cranio from such a passionate, talented teacher who infuses his classes with good humor and a deep dive into stillness. He strives to use simple language that engages our spontaneity. His methods are the middle ground between biomechanics Upledger style and biodynamic Sutherland style. 

In his classes, students learn to start from a no-mind space, a place where the mind can take a vacation, allowing their practice to unfold in non-duality, or what he calls the Midline.

He emphasizes the power of touch to stimulate the secretion of oxytocin, a hormone that brings a feeling of oneness and values clarity as the result of being in touch with that Midline that connects us with our life-force, our true and infinite potential.

Etienne travels the world with his life partner Toshiko, teaching where he is invited to share this opportunity of radical self transformation. He is also launching his first ever online class, that will have fascinating lectures and detailed instruction on all the hand placements, as a resource for students to learn and enjoy Cranio.

00:22 - Anna Esparham

Okay, good, okay. Hey everyone, welcome to Health is Pow her. I am so excited for today's episode because we are gonna talk about Cranial Sacral with Atn Piers mean he has a story to tell you about how he got into Cranial Sacral, he has um, a awesome, awesome course, several courses online, and so I'm gonna link it to both the show notes as well as the podcast details. I highly recommend Cranial Sacral. This is something I have been learning about, foundationally just because I've been dealing with headaches and pain, for my patients and it's super, super amazing and what you can do with Crania Sacral.

01:06 - Anna Esparham

So I highly recommend you learn this. So welcome Atn we're so happy to have you.

01:14 - Etienne Peirsman

All right, thank you, thank you for imparting me yes, an honor, you know, to be connected to Kirksville. Yes, that's where settlement started, right?

01:27 - Anna Esparham

Sutherland learned from at Still and then, I took um, the Osteopathic Cranial Academy, their 1st beginners course. It's for Mds and Dos, I think.

01:41 - Etienne Peirsman

Yes, they're still doing that, okay.

01:45 - Anna Esparham

So yeah, I'm excited. I, I learned a little bit, I learned some of the, the respiratory mechanism and it's, it's very subtle, it's, you have to be very feeling with your hands, it's very difficult to learn.

02:00 - Etienne Peirsman

Well, yes. How do you like that, to be so quiet?

02:04 - Anna Esparham

I do because I I started. Learning meditation and started doing more intuitive healing. Because I dealt with a lot,

02:14 - Etienne Peirsman

Yes.

02:14 - Anna Esparham

With a lot of chronic health issues and that's what led me to build Health is Power.

02:19 - Anna Esparham

Because, even like integrative medicine, I, you know, because I'm both conventional integrative medicine and I'm acupuncture and you know, all these certifications. But really that I don't know that intuitive healing, that spiritual, that listening to the body is super important because, you know, Not everything can be diagnosed with a lab test, ultrasound, you know, procedure. And so that's where this crania sacral, this feeling comes in that you can actually diagnose with this subtleness of that feeling.

02:54 - Etienne Peirsman

Yes, on top of it, it's fun not having to do

02:57 - Anna Esparham

Yeah, it's fun.

03:00 - Etienne Peirsman

Connect to the intelligence that's there already. Yes, yes.

03:07 - Anna Esparham

I'm excited. I'm excited to learn from you today. I wanna hear about your story and how you got into this.

03:14 - Etienne Peirsman

Oh well, you know, let me tell you, I came from a totally different direction, into the healing arts. Yeah, not, not. Because I wanted to hear people, but you know, yeah, because I enjoy the silence, I enjoy the uh, aspect of How to say that exactly? Well, I came actually to crane your sacral because it brought me the closest to the happiness of dying. The silence of dying, the silence of total letting go. Aspect. Yeah, that, because yeah, that's what happened to me. And the ability to self heal is also what I went through.

04:07 - Etienne Peirsman

And those two aspects together. Yeah, when you are given up by the medical world and your body that was what was happening to me my fellows were all gone in the heart one kidney was close to seventy percent dead material the other kidney was eighty seven percent dead material so that's a death sentence You know what, what happened, of course is total panic. You have when you're 40 years old and you realize life is over, you panic. That's what I did. On top of that, I couldn't feel my body anymore.

04:51 - Etienne Peirsman

I had no connection whatsoever to the body that I knew. It was that severe. So yeah, then I, you know, what do you do in a moment like that? Either you keep on panicking or you go unconscious or you meditate as a Rast last resort. I meditated and half an hour into the meditation, suddenly They ate something flipped in me and I found myself in total, no mind, in total acceptance, in total, wow, yeah, just the magnificence of being. And the body, of course was totally broken, but that didn't matter.

05:37 - Etienne Peirsman

I was so happy, so satisfied, so at ease in that space and yes, yeah, then of course, yeah, all kinds of stuff happened. They brought me to the hospital to get rid of the bacteria, that happened, but the body was still broken and uh, so then they put me in a war to it. Double my age, 80 years old, that were ready to die the whole room at one night, started to die one after the other. It was like, the last show on earth. I was laying there watching everybody go yeah th that process, one after the other.

06:30 - Etienne Peirsman

And then, of course, it was my turn because my body was so damaged that it couldn't stay alive anymore. So that's what happened. I could feel the different aspects of when a body starts to deconstruct.

06:46 - Etienne Peirsman

Yeah, the heaviness, the cold, the heat, the burning up and then the explosion, yeah, it's exploding. Into a universe of millions and millions of light points. Yeah, that was what was happening to me. I was just watching all that stuff happen. And then, yeah, something else happened. The last person of that whole room who was also dying, I could feel this neat. There was something with his heart. It is not that I could feel that, but in an instant I was back in the body. And it didn't fit anymore.

07:35 - Etienne Peirsman

That was the 1st thing that I noticed, but it was just a split and I went over to him and I put my hand on his chest, and since I was still in that expansiveness of the universe my hand and this is crazy. This is physically totally impossible. But my hand went into his chest. I could see my hand just going in there and literally touching his heart. Now this is not possible. Yeah, but since I was in that alternative space, yeah, that was what was happening. So yeah, he something happened with his heart by the touch and he stayed alive.

08:26 - Etienne Peirsman

Back in a body that didn't function anymore. We became best friends afterwards. Yeah,

08:32 - Anna Esparham

Hey.

08:32 - Etienne Peirsman

So there I was back In a body that didn't function anymore, Story went on, Yeah. They gave me so much medication to keep my kidneys going and my heart going that I knew, yeah, this is going to kill me. It was a crazy idea. I already died almost. Yeah, came back and then the medication, this is going to kill me. So I told the Dr., I'm out of here and I had to sign, you know? I called a friend, and this was in Europe, in the Netherlands and I'm born in Belgium and in the south of Belgium there are these woods.

09:21 - Etienne Peirsman

Yeah, it's a wooded area. So I asked him, you know, bring me to. The woods? Why, no, I need to go to the woods, so he drove me there. It took us a whole day, You know. I had no clue where to go, so go here, go there. Suddenly, you know, around midnight, we were in a dead end in the middle of the forest and all right, we couldn't go any further. I said this is it. So we put up a tent, yeah, small one. He goes in there to sleep. I also, but it was so confined. Yeah, also his energy was so Hectic I couldn't stay in there, so I went out and started wandering in the forest.

10:13 - Etienne Peirsman

And then a little further down I saw it clearing with trees that were in a circle. And the strange thing was this is the middle of the forest. The strange thing was the clearing was a light, there was a light there, it was, it was As if there was a light.

10:30 - Anna Esparham

Wow.

10:33 - Etienne Peirsman

So yeah, of course I go there. It's a pine forest, so a very it was middle of the summer, a very nice carpet, you know, all these pine needles. So I went to sleep there in the middle of that clearing, and then as soon as I laid down I was out of my body and looking at the body in the clearing, just being there. And then, you know, the whole night animals came to sniff what is happening here snakes and foxes and rodents and all kinds of things I've never even seen in my life. And then a boar, you know, one of those big boars.

11:15 - Anna Esparham

Oh, my word.

11:17 - Etienne Peirsman

A whole bunch, maybe 20 small ones, all sniffing and looking. And what I did see was the immense respect of those animals for what was happening. And I had no clue what was happening, but I saw that. And none of them, even the small little boys, none of them touched me. They were just sniffing, and we were walking away, coming back, sniff again, and then disappearing. And in the morning, when the sun came up, I just got back in the body. It was like the sunlight allowed me to be back in the body.

11:57 - Etienne Peirsman

So I sat there the whole day meditating. And my friend came once in a while with a bit of soup. And this happened for four days in a row, that I was at night out of the body in the day just sitting there meditating. And then after four days I told my friend to Okay, it's Tom. I'm good. All right, we left. And then a week later I went to the hospital because I was curious, you know, how does it look inside? So they checked me out, you know, turned me inside out. My heart was fully healed all the valves were restored and the strange thing is all my kidneys both of them were a hundred percent regenerated total regeneration this is Eighty six I'm still here.

12:48 - Anna Esparham

Wow. You're alive.

13:00 - Etienne Peirsman

Totally. It gave me, it gave me a connection with what is healing, what is self healing, Yeah, without any, anything, yeah, And then, you know, because my body was still weak, yeah, of that whole thing, it took me about nine months to gain my strength back and then I felt I have to do something, yeah, for my whole body, to rearrange all my muscles and everything. So I took an intense massage course was four months non stop, day in, day out and in there, there was four days of grano. And as soon the, the massage, I couldn't care less.

13:49 - Etienne Peirsman

All the doing, oh my God, no. But anyway, the four days of grano, immediately, as soon as I felt that I knew. This is what I'm gonna do for the rest of my life. And since that day I haven't been doing anything else, just grano cranial, day in, day out, almost. Yeah, yeah.

14:13 - Anna Esparham

That's beautiful. I love it. I can't wait. I can't wait to get there. Yeah, I, I hope to keep learning and keep feeling and keep practicing and, and get there like you are. So it's just an amazing modality. It just, you could do so much like my, my teachers were they would just feel, they would just touch the head or they would even touch other areas of the body and like know what was going on in the whole body. They were like, oh, the, the Fasci is too tight on your right hip and they would just touch the head and you know, they would touch the head and it was like, oh wow, your feet are, you know, they're constricted, there's not blood flow going there.

14:50 - Anna Esparham

I was just like, wow, that's so crazy. They could feel all that.

14:57 - Etienne Peirsman

Yes, it's just fine tuning, you know, we all know how to feel, you know your body perfectly, and it's just fine tuning, that's all it is.

15:10 - Anna Esparham

I'm excited.

15:11 - Etienne Peirsman

Of course, practice here.

15:13 - Anna Esparham

Practice, practice makes perfect. So Tell us,

15:16 - Etienne Peirsman

Yeah.

15:17 - Anna Esparham

tell us a little bit about some of your stories with healing in terms of seeing patients and clients and I mean tell us a little bit about what you've seen and some of these miracles that have happened.

15:30 - Etienne Peirsman

Wellll you know, they're not really miracles, they're based on understanding the body. That's one thing, but also understanding how to connect to cells. Cells and especially stem cells in the body. They are, they don't have a mind, they don't have a brain, they're just pure energy, and they're connected to the universal intelligence Universal wisdom, the life force, the breath of life, like Sutherland called it. Yeah, they're connected to that, so they don't think there is no thinking happening in stem cells, but they know what to do.

16:12 - Etienne Peirsman

Yeah, and of course,

16:14 - Anna Esparham

Hello.

16:14 - Etienne Peirsman

Know, and that's one of the things, when I started with Grano, that was in the very beginning, you know, I am not, trained by osteopaths. Well, I am trained by osteopaths, but not in an osteopathic college. So there was total freedom to explore and especially in the beginning in the one thousand nine hundred eighty seconds nobody literally knew what grano was all about It gave me a chance to explore the rhythms, to explore how to work with bones and stuff like that and also finally to work with stem cells.

16:57 - Etienne Peirsman

You know, it's, it's been learning experience from that no mind space. And of course, you know, in embryology. Yeah, the very 1st stem cell, that is the fertilized egg, that's the very 1st stem cell. And that cell is at this point holding a cup of coffee or whatever it is you're holding with buds in your ears. That stem cell created your body without thinking. Yeah, there is When does the mind start? When you're two years old, three years old, but then your body was already created. So that intelligence that does that, yeah, that is connected to what we call that no mind space, yeah, where you thinking literally is not happening, you tap into the universal intelligence means, yeah, you don't think, you just wait for intuition.

18:09 - Anna Esparham

Yes, I like that, Yeah.

18:10 - Etienne Peirsman

You'd just wait and wait. And in the beginning that's the most difficult thing because we're so train. So trained, and the competition and the thing to have it right not to give the wrong answers, mind. Yes.

18:31 - Anna Esparham

I know in my,

18:32 - Etienne Peirsman

Yes, of course know.

18:34 - Anna Esparham

My 1st class doing the cranial osteopathy course, they were like, this is not about doing. They had to get it out of our heads because we're, we're just

18:44 - Etienne Peirsman

Yes, and that's the most difficult thing to do, yeah.

18:49 - Anna Esparham

Was so hard.

18:50 - Etienne Peirsman

Yeah, that, that's where, where the whole thing comes about, you know, when connecting with these, Oh yeah, you were asking for miracles. Well, yeah, okay, one of them. And this happened maybe four or five times, with my students, two students and three clients who had a bleeding. One of them was so deeply, deeply paralyzed that the doctors in the hospital told her husband She's, this was a student, she's never going to be able to do anything anymore. You better look for a good home because she will not be able to take care of herself any more.

19:36 - Etienne Peirsman

She couldn't talk, she couldn't walking one side, totally paralyzed. Four grano sexual scal sessions later. She's s walking. She's talking.

19:51 - Anna Esparham

Wow.

19:53 - Etienne Peirsman

And this is not just one example, one of my dear friends had the same thing happen, and this is an amazing story. She got paralyzed, not as severely as the other one, and she could still use an arm, she could talk a little bit, but I could hear the talking of Herr was disconnected from thinking, it was just spontaneous, so all right, you know, can you? Her husband called me. He was also an acupuncture teacher. Can you come in and treat? Whatever her name is? Oh yeah, sure, you know, and I was on my way to the Us, but I still had the day in Belgium to go see her now, middle of the summer, no clouds, blue sky.

20:45 - Etienne Peirsman

She's at the top floor of the hospital, the very top. So all right, I'm there with her and You know, I hold her head and uh, we go look at where is the damage in the head and with bleeding. Yeah, the place that is damaged feels like wood. It has a strange feeling, it feels like wood and it's totally dark. There is absolutely no light in there, no life, no electricity, nothing. So she knew the space. Talked about it. And so I'm asking Herr, you know, and this is crazy. I ask her what do you need?

21:30 - Etienne Peirsman

What does this place need? She said light. At the moment that she said that There is this lightning strike right above our heads, you know, like a huge car. The nurses came running,

21:47 - Etienne Peirsman

like what's happening, you know,

21:49 - Anna Esparham

Way.

21:49 - Etienne Peirsman

Machine exploded, her husband also came running. No, no, leave us alone. That was, you know, being connected to the life force. Yeah,

22:05 - Anna Esparham

Wow.

22:05 - Etienne Peirsman

All right, you know, when you find that space and then, you know, the thing is at that moment as a practitioner. Your voice. My voice need to come from that. No mind space at that point. Start talking with the mind's voice. Yeah, you connect to a different vibration in the brain and things are not going to happen. But when you connect to no mind voice, which is hypnotic almost, yeah, you connect to stem cells, you connect to the same vibration that they are functioning. And the brain is all about vibration, about how Certain areas of the brain wake up.

22:59 - Etienne Peirsman

Due to pure vibration. So I started talking to her. And you know, there is glia cells in the brain. There is, you know, the arteries and veins need to be repaired, that's all. Different type of immune cells that do that. And then all right, the glia cells, the microglia, they clean up the mess and Nse, neural stem cells will create new brain material. So we started doing that, that she was actively involved with feeling, because you can feel that activity where, yeah, the cells were eating away at all the garbage there and no stuff was being created.

23:45 - Etienne Peirsman

Now two months later, she's back in a practice, she's back doing cranial sacro, you

23:54 - Anna Esparham

Oh,

23:54 - Etienne Peirsman

So Things that are I repairable,

23:54 - Anna Esparham

cool.

23:57 - Etienne Peirsman

so called the repairable, yeah. If you understand how it functions and you can connect to the cells that have to do it. That's part of, of no mind because yeah, they only listen to that same vibration. If you come with a different thing, they might do stuff, but not as pure as they should or as is possible. What other? Oh, this is, this is a nice, this is to be one of the most beautiful things I ever experienced. There is this seven year old. He's dyslexic. Now at that moment in class when you're dyslexic, you can't read.

24:47 - Etienne Peirsman

Everybody's gonna la with you. Yeah, the other kids also learn to read, but hey, there is one who really can do it. So everybody's frustration comes out and he's gonna be laughing stock and Probably, you know, this will ruin his life, and most chance that he will become a bully just to get even with the others. Just to get also is, say, in there. So all right, he comes for his mom called, He's dyslexic. So they come to my practice and I wrote, Mom, you wait here and I'll take the kid to my treatment room.

25:29 - Etienne Peirsman

And on the way now, by the way, dyslexia means the right temporal bone is stuck. That part of the brain, the right temporal lobe is the brain is the part that picks up reading. How it does it, nobody knows, but all right, that's where it happens. So that will be stuck. So I could do that, just hold these ears and do the ear pole until it relaxes. That tator youm relaxes over, everything's back to normal, he'll probably read in a few weeks, but I thought I'll do it different. Live with this guy, you know.

26:09 - Etienne Peirsman

So on the way to my treatment room, I ask him what is that dyslexia? He looks at me like I'm the moron, you know. He comes to be treated and I have to ask him what it is. All right. So, but it gave him a chance to talk about what happens in class. So all right, you know. So I would said all right, you know. Well I know a few tricks, let's see what works. So I put him on the T or he climbs on the table. And then my 2nd stupid question, I ask him where do you do that in your body? Read. He looks at me like really in my head.

26:50 - Etienne Peirsman

Of course I said, oh okay, I knew that I was just checking, but all right, he started feeling a little better about himself at that point.

27:02 - Anna Esparham

Yeah,

27:02 - Anna Esparham

they're always smarter than you,

27:03 - Anna Esparham

for sure.

27:04 - Etienne Peirsman

I All right, let's go look at where you read. So I put my hand on his heart. I said, all right now, make yourself, you know what blood is, yes, you know what blood is, you know what blood cells are, of course, you know, a seven year old, they're so knowledgeable, you know, of course, you know, I said, make yourself into a whole bunch of small blood cells so we can travel around together. Oh yeah, of course, seven year old Bom, that's what it does. So I put my hand on his side. I said all right, let's go to your brain, but 1st we need oxygen.

27:48 - Etienne Peirsman

So I put my hands, I go to his lungs, I said all right, breathe a few times, take in some oxygen so we can go delivery to your brain, all right, So now back to the heart and now there is two roads you can take, this one or that one is carotids, yeah, so I go with my hand,

28:08 - Etienne Peirsman

I point out which way he said,

28:10 - Etienne Peirsman

I said which one you want. Both, okay, both. So both we go up there and I go behind this here. So okay, now we go into your brain and now go to your eyes. Behind your eyes there's a traffic circle. And you know, I'm not into fantasy, This is the reality, the Circle of Willis, all right. So we are at the Circle of Willis. And of course he knew what the traffic circle was. So I asked him, look at the road, how is the road and is the road okay, Can you travel everywhere? Yeah, it's okay, but on this side the road is broken up.

28:54 - Etienne Peirsman

Now that side is the place where the arteries start that go to with temporal lobe. So all right, you know, I said, well, luckily it's the word I use a lot. In the blood there is so many little helpers and if they find Something to clean or to repair, they will do that immediately.

29:21 - Etienne Peirsman

And as soon as I mentioned that I could feel activity. So macrophages, they were already at the spot, feeling what needed to be done. Can you feel them? You know, And it is important at that point when I feel it, to point it out because then the feeling is also in him. Yeah, he could feel it as said, tell them to repair it. Then he became silent. What do they need now? That seven year old wakes up again? A few weeks before, the road in his house was broken up in front of his house at home, and then the guys came to fix the road with all their big yellow machines.

30:13 - Etienne Peirsman

His workers also. And he had seen the workers. They didn't start to work before. A big container was put there where they could make coffee,

30:24 - Anna Esparham

Yeah.

30:25 - Etienne Peirsman

Read the paper, go to the toilet, they need the container. His guys also wanted the container. All right, put the container there and then, all right, they start working. So within three 4 min, the circle of wellness was repaired. This is the reality of stem cells and immune cells.

30:48 - Etienne Peirsman

They only live for a few weeks. They're not gonna take months to repair something. Their reality is no time, no mind, no time. They function instantly and it takes them a few minutes at the most to repair something. You know, they clean the whole body at night, trillions of cells they need to check.

31:19 - Etienne Peirsman

Yeah, so their life or their timing is so different than what we, our mind thinks about time. Yeah, it is almost instant repair. So within a few minutes it was fixed. Now this happened so often that things that need to be fixed will be fixed within seconds or minutes. It doesn't take an hour or half an hour. Yeah, and the reason, it's something I needed to discover. It has also to do with feeling the reality of no time, how instant they do that. So anyway it's fixed. So now let's go look at where you read.

32:17 - Etienne Peirsman

Now there is art to reach that, go there. I have no clue what they're ca. And it doesn't matter either, you know, because the arteries don't know what they're called either. Yeah, So I tell him take the right road. To go there all right. He takes the right road, we arrive. Fin Oh yeah, before that I forgot a major part in the very beginning. When he was on the table. I have my hands on his head. This is before we go into the heart and the oxygen. Before that, I ask him Where do you read? Do you read on this side or on this

33:01 - Anna Esparham

Yeah.

33:02 - Etienne Peirsman

He says On this side, okay, Do you read here, here or here? Every time I move my hand in a different spot in the middle, do you read here or here there? Within half a minute, he tells me where in his brain reading happens.

33:27 - Anna Esparham

You're ta, so you're really tapping in, you're helping the patient also tap into their intuitive healing.

33:36 - Etienne Peirsman

Yes, yes. And a seven year old, that's where they live in the, in their intuitive, that's where they still at, yeah, So he pointed out very unbelievable.

33:50 - Anna Esparham

Do you. Do you find it easier to, to teach the kid? Do you find it easier to, to teach the kids that versus the adults?

33:57 - Etienne Peirsman

Oh yeah, give me a kit anytime instead of an adult. It's so also so much more fun because then I can be a kid also.

34:08 - Anna Esparham

It's nice, yeah, because I'm a pediatrician by training and so we do. I teach a lot of the intuitive healing through the hypnosis and teaching them to do the selfie and it's so easy. It's like,

34:19 - Etienne Peirsman

Oh yeah, they pick it up like they live there.

34:23 - Anna Esparham

Yeah, it's fun, and then I get ideas from them. I'm like, oh, that's cool.

34:28 - Etienne Peirsman

Of course, you know, So all right, we go there where reading happens, so all right, I have no clue how a brain does that, so I think all right, you know, how did I learn to read? Well, I have a desk and then I ask him the people, the people that read for you, the cells. Do they have a desk? Yeah, they do. Do they have a chair to sit? Yeah, they do. Do they have enough light? Yes, they do, so why can't they read? Well, they need a book, of course, a I forgot to measure the book all right, give them a book all right.

35:14 - Etienne Peirsman

So now they have a book, they have a desk, they have a light, they have a seat, why can't they read? He says Well, they're all on top of each other. The compression. I said, oh wait a minute. You know, I made it into, oh wait a minute. So now I grab his ears and I do the ear poll and it was so tight, it was unbelievable. So I said, can you feel that elastic? Yeah, it's tight, isn't it? Yeah, it's really tight. He said, whose elastic is it? Mine soon as he said mine, I could feel a little bit of relaxation as it all right, you know, you tell them to relax, I'll help you.

36:01 - Etienne Peirsman

So it took us seven,

36:02 - Anna Esparham

Ohh, yeah.

36:03 - Etienne Peirsman

8 min before the tantum literally started to relax, you know, And it's just a matter of Wait. Yeah, when the attention is there, when the energy is there, yeah, and you just wait, it will relax by itself. So after seven, 8 min, he was so relaxed. I said, all right, go home, come back in two weeks. Two weeks later they both come, his mom and me, with a smile on their face. The next day in class he could read just like

36:41 - Anna Esparham

Wow.

36:43 - Etienne Peirsman

On top of that, I didn't do it, he did it, he did it. He was in charge, you know, because I was just a dumb person asking stupid questions.

37:01 - Anna Esparham

He knows more than you do, that's for sure. When you teach them in your classes, are you anybody can take your classes or is there? Do they have to have prerequisite?

37:16 - Etienne Peirsman

Well, it's the, it's the total opposite of where you're going.

37:20 - Anna Esparham

Okay.

37:21 - Etienne Peirsman

I teach people that have no clue about bodies. And I notice, yeah, then I can be, it's much easier for them. They are not programmed in knowledge and you know, okay, you know, this Way and it's,

37:38 - Anna Esparham

Oh, yeah.

37:41 - Etienne Peirsman

you know, I'm not saying this is good, that's not good, but I found it for myself easier to teach people who have less knowledge about the body so that they are much easier to go into, no mind to get out of their brain, out of their head, out of their thoughts. Yeah, it's much easier for them.

38:08 - Anna Esparham

I agree, because I've learned a lot of intuitive healing. I've trained and intuitive healing and um, in, in clinical practice when I'm using my mind, my logic, I can't. It's so hard for me to access the intuition. It like kind of shuts off when I'm using.

38:28 - Etienne Peirsman

Yes, it's one or the other and it's, it's basically the 1st. Thing we learn, you know, and I call this instant mindfulness. You know, when we touch, yeah, that's usually the 1st thing yet to touch. And usually it's the wrist, you know, we start with respiratory diaphragm. So they have to put the arm out of the way. And I make it into a whole, a whole thing, just to connect and not to, not to move your hand, what is your thumb feeling, what is your index finger, what is that one, what is your palm?

39:07 - Etienne Peirsman

So they're really going into total feeling. And then the mind stops. That's one of the tricks. Either you feel totally or you think. And of course we all think that we can feel and think at the same time, but that's, you know, that's, that's neither here nor there. It's just have, you can stop that mind totally. So much energy becomes available for, yeah, for just touch and feeling. And on top of that, after a minute of touch, we call it conscious touch, after a minute bod bodies. Will start flooding both bodies.

39:57 - Anna Esparham

Yeahp.

39:57 - Etienne Peirsman

Both brains will start flooding both bodies with oxytocin, which is the hormone that binds, that makes one mom and, and baby, yeah, become a unit with oxytocin. So that's what happens to your client and yourself if you're able to just, yeah, be that conscious. Touch brings instant mindfulness and then on top of that, you're not separated from your client anymore. Yeah, when you're in on oxy A notion you're one means you feel everything that the client feels. Mirrors in your own body, Yeah, and you just have to pay attention to it and it's right there.

40:45 - Anna Esparham

Yeah, Do. I interviewed this other Dr., Dr. Mary Nsel, who's a neurologist and she was talking about why she loves practicing and taking care of patients because of that connection with the other patient. She actually said there's studies where the energy waves, especially the Eeg, since she's a neurologist, she's looked at the brain waves and how they sink when you are connected with your patient, so that's interesting.

41:20 - Etienne Peirsman

Yes, yeah, you know, and then the other thing that we use is, yeah, that no mind voice. And that no mind voice. It, it wakes up certain areas like the anterior singular Gys of the brain. Yeah, it gets activated by the purity of mom's voice with a baby, yet the voice of love, which is oxytocin, then mom's voice is pure, there is no dissonance there. And then that area gets activated, gets ignited. Yeah, with love. That's the foundation on which the human brain then will grow, yeah, on top of, yeah, an activated area of the brain activated by love, yeah, And that means that person's foundation is love the ability to laugh.

42:26 - Etienne Peirsman

If they take a baby away, then the baby's anterior singular gys hears the voices of the nurses. Nothing wrong with that. But if they're talking about how their date went last night, that's what they talk about right then. Yeah, they're going to be dissonance. In the vibration. Yes,

42:51 - Anna Esparham

Listen, I know I In the nursery as a pediatrician.

42:52 - Etienne Peirsman

yes.

42:54 - Anna Esparham

Oh boy or babies, Students who take your courses, Do they? Since you're so good at the intuitive healing and you heal yourself, do are they able to heal themselves? Okay, cool.

43:17 - Etienne Peirsman

Of course, you know, one of the things that, that I do is I call this an intensive, what is I call it, but I forget. It's an intense programm where in two and a half months they go through nine courses, which is Yes, the whole spectrum of grano, comes by and we end with an intensive class. So they go really through their own stuff. Yeah, it's called shit.

43:55 - Etienne Peirsman

They go really. You know, it's part of when you connect to that life force, the breadth of life. Yeah, it pushes everything that's not natural to the surface. You start feeling where the body is disconnected, what needs to be happening physically and Emotions start to come up. Then you know that these hormones that create emotion, emotion need to be released. Yeah,

44:30 - Etienne Peirsman

it's stock energy. So that comes to the surface and of course mental loops also come to the surface. So everything, the Shi comes literally, yeah, to the surface. And that's then part of the course is all right to deal with that. Yeah, to go into what is it all about? And yeah, it, it's an intensive, intensive way of learning cranial. And after nine courses they just are cranial. Yeah, they've been, let's say they have a four day class, maybe I talk one full morning and maybe 2 h if day.

45:23 - Etienne Peirsman

So that means that six 7 h are handsome part of the class. Yeah, is basically minimal, minimal minimal. Instruction. Me lecturing, Yeah, very minimal. And it's more, you know, one of the things I use and that's quite unique actually. When they're on the table, that's when I guide them. I tell them what they expect, what to feel, what they are able to feel, what is popping up, what is not popping up, where to pay attention, when to wait, when to go on. I feel that in myself because I've been doing it so long.

46:08 - Etienne Peirsman

So I feel the energy movement and I can guide them. Yeah, all right, this is what you're feeling, Yeah, so there is no confusion, Yeah, and that helps so much, Yeah, It was actually guided reality of what the feeling is all about.

46:30 - Anna Esparham

That's how my teachers taught us, they would literally when we were feeling the energy and, and the resp, resp it, I say respiration, it's um, a rhythm of the energy in the brain and, and the body and the movement and the fluid movement and everything. And so the teachers would literally either they put their hand on top of our hand and,

46:54 - Etienne Peirsman

Oh,

46:54 - Anna Esparham

or,

46:54 - Etienne Peirsman

yeah.

46:54 - Anna Esparham

Or they would just put the hand somewhere else in the body and be able to feel what we're feeling and then guide, guide our feeling.

47:02 - Anna Esparham

I was like, how is this possible? It's cool.

47:07 - Etienne Peirsman

And it's so easy once you're there. It's really, you know, like you've done this every day.

47:14 - Anna Esparham

That's cool, it's so cool, so interesting and I, I love it because this is it. I'm so happy because in medicine in Md schools we don't learn this and via, right? And so that's exciting for me because this is a, this is actually accredited, you know, conventional medicine, you know, especially on the do side, and we get insurance reimbursement for this. This is real, I mean this is, this is real medicine, is

47:40 - Etienne Peirsman

This reality.

47:41 - Anna Esparham

So it's, it's really amazing. So you have both, I was looking through your courses, you have both online and in person.

47:50 - Etienne Peirsman

Yes the online is something that we just started yes and uh because you know in person I can only be in one place at the same time but the online you know I can be all over the world and that is still happening I get invited you know maybe you know that a few years ago uh two thousand six I came out with a book Grano Sacral Therapy for Babies and Small Children.

48:19 - Anna Esparham

Oh, maybe I have that book.

48:22 - Etienne Peirsman

Yes, you mind it's filled with pictures.

48:25 - Anna Esparham

I think I might.

48:27 - Etienne Peirsman

Yes,

48:28 - Anna Esparham

I haven't read it yet.

48:30 - Etienne Peirsman

Yeah,

48:30 - Anna Esparham

I'm there.

48:30 - Etienne Peirsman

don't,

48:31 - Anna Esparham

I.

48:31 - Etienne Peirsman

Don't read it. Look at the pictures. We brought it out just for an emotional reaction of the pictures.

48:40 - Anna Esparham

Okay.

48:42 - Etienne Peirsman

And of course the text is wonderful also, but that's secondary. So yeah, with that, you know, I get invited still and all places in the world actually, and you know, with the online I can be anywhere.

49:01 - Anna Esparham

Cool, that's really cool. I'm excited. Yeah, Look, oh my gosh, you have amazing classes. You, you go pretty in depth too. You're, you're doing all kinds of systems as well, immune system, eyes and visions. So as in Fash, I mean you, you get into it.

49:21 - Etienne Peirsman

The total body and A granular alone doesn't cut it fully.

49:22 - Anna Esparham

That's.

49:27 - Etienne Peirsman

You know. There is also a few classes like Soba. Work is also about releasing of emotion and working with intimacy. That's one part. Then I also have two courses Systemic work family constellations How to, how to do that when your client is on the tables with their eyes closed, how to, yeah, introduce a constellation. What else do we have brainwork. You know where we go into the brain, which is a little bit beyond Grano. Grano works with the environment of the brain. Brain work. You go with the nuclei in the brain and the alarm class working with the alarm systems, that's our 1st brain class.

50:16 - Etienne Peirsman

And then there is two other brain classes and then Death and dying, of course, is what I'm very familiar with. We are adding at this point is vaginal work, of course is only for women. Yeah, they, I'm not

50:41 - Anna Esparham

It's great.

50:42 - Etienne Peirsman

You know, to just connect to the and it's more than just the drama of a woman. Yeah, it's about femininity and uh, you know, the, the way society is structured, the thousands of years of, Yet all that comes up and of course in the vagina you can treat anything in the body. My girlfriend,

51:06 - Anna Esparham

really.

51:07 - Etienne Peirsman

It is amazing. My girlfriend, she does that a lot, you know, with, with her clients, female clients, you know, to rearrange the vagina and uh, the, the Wom, you know, the position of the Ser. Everything, everything comes up, all the drama, everything. It is just amazing.

51:35 - Anna Esparham

Is it, is it combining? Because I know pelvic floor physical therapy and they work with the vagina and they help release a lot of the somatic issues going on, but this is even beyond that I imagine.

51:51 - Etienne Peirsman

Yes, imagine that work in a grano Sgr way where you just hold and wait for the vagina to start releasing.

52:04 - Anna Esparham

This would probably help a lott of women with, because a lot of women who have pelvic pain syndromes, pelvic uh or uh, painful bladder syndromes, dys perona, painless sex. I imagine some people, some women who go through the just the pelvic floor physical therapy, they, they still have a lot of symptoms, so I wonder if this would also help them.

52:27 - Etienne Peirsman

You know you cannot release something if you don't look at the emotion.

52:31 - Anna Esparham

Know that's the big thing and that's what they say. It's like the pain and the emotions like that does have to be released.

52:36 - Etienne Peirsman

Of That needs to come out and also the mental hookups also need to be addressed. And then one of the other things is that hasn't happened yet, but with the, of course the Cox sics, but also with the prostate. The penis and the testicles, you know, that's then work for, yeah, you need.

53:07 - Anna Esparham

Cause they, well, men have the pelvic floor dysfunction too and they can have the P,

53:12 - Etienne Peirsman

Of course.

53:12 - Anna Esparham

The pelvic as well. And it's harder for them because they don't have access like women. It's easier to do the vaginal, you know, physical therapy and release and men they have a tougher time, so that's, that's nicer.

53:28 - Etienne Peirsman

Yes, and finally I found somebody who's able to teach that.

53:33 - Anna Esparham

Oh, good,

53:34 - Etienne Peirsman

Yes,

53:34 - Etienne Peirsman

yes. And she's been doing that for quite a long time actually. And it's a woman, but you know, it's, she's so neutral at it that it doesn't, there is absolutely no hint of, you know, sexuality that comes up. These feelings might come up, but you know it's not. She's so neutral at it that she can teach about it.

53:59 - Anna Esparham

That's Bea, that's wonderful, Okay, And you teach, is it mainly in New Mexico or you? Sometime it just depends on the schedule.

54:07 - Etienne Peirsman

Oh yeah. I'm in Washington State. I'm in Idaho. I'm in Taiwan. Hong Kong next year, Japan. I'm in Europe, in Gree, in Prague, in Amsterdam. So wherever people ask me to go.

54:24 - Anna Esparham

You go, okay, Well, maybe you need to come to Kirksville. You need to come to, to our place and hang out with us. Maybe we'll make that happen one day, okay, So everyone for if anyone's interested in taking these classes there's the online classes there's the in person classes you can find all this information um at piers mean cranial sacral dott com uh I'm gonna have the links in my show notes in the transcript and in the podcast details but you'll spell it like this it's As in Paul e I r s as in sam m as in Mary a nn as in nancy cran o sac girl which is c r a nn as in nancy I o s as in sam a c r a l dot com again I'm gonna have these links all over in my instagram Facebook linkedin at health is paw hur and health is paw hur dot com as well is there anything else you didn't touch on.

55:04 - Etienne Peirsman

Yes. Oh, yeah, so much. My next book for one but let me add a little website that's easier to remember grano rocks dot com like rock cran or rocks and that will will bring people into our websites.

55:47 - Anna Esparham

Oh, Oh, that's Ohh, that's so much easier to spell out than the piers mean, Ohh, there it goes, so it's automatic, good, Okayy, I love it. Cranial rocks O okay, so c r a n I o rock r o c k s, Okay, good.

56:08 - Etienne Peirsman

Yeah, I prefer to call it cranial. That's he.

56:11 - Anna Esparham

Cranial Okay, good, Easy, peasy, wait, what's your new book coming out?

56:18 - Etienne Peirsman

That's maybe a month or two months away, and it's called the Tric Aspects of Grano Sacro.

56:25 - Anna Esparham

Oh, okay, great, awesome, cool.

56:28 - Etienne Peirsman

One of the main topics is lotus birth. It's a birth without aggression.

56:39 - Anna Esparham

Oh, I had never heard of them.

56:41 - Etienne Peirsman

Well, you know, the traditional way of birthing, nowadays more than 50 % of the babies are cesarean.

56:51 - Anna Esparham

Yes, I've, yeah, I'm, I'm learning about this.

56:54 - Etienne Peirsman

Biologically speaking, they are never born.

56:58 - Anna Esparham

It's hard. Yeah, they need to have that. I've heard that they need have that

57:02 - Etienne Peirsman

yes, but then,

57:03 - Anna Esparham

Yeah, I've been reading this.

57:04 - Etienne Peirsman

but then If that's, you know, if they come out a normal way, the 1st thing we do is we become aggressive. We either clamp the court or cut the court,

57:16 - Etienne Peirsman

that placenta and the umbilical court. Much to offer that still needs to migrate into the baby. There is so many stem cells there and other immune cells and hormones, neurotransmitter. The placenta is a treasure cove and all that stuff needs to go in. The baby, you know, the placenta, the umbilical cord and the baby, that all comes from that fertilized egg. So when you cut it off at the very beginning, you cut something of life, of the baby. Now what is Lotus bird? And I Started connecting to that because I started meeting babies who were born without aggression and it takes about three to seven eight nine days max for that placenta to really bring everything into the baby you can almost see it shrivel up and then the court also start to shrivel and then after three four five six seven days it disconnects by itself is a full bird Without any intervention,

58:01 - Anna Esparham

Yeah.

58:40 - Etienne Peirsman

it's called Lotus Bird.

58:46 - Anna Esparham

Oh, I'm gonna have to read about that. In fact, I think, we'll probably have a, if it, if your book comes out well within the next yeah, month or two, we might be able to put it on the links as well. I'll have to look.

59:02 - Etienne Peirsman

Yes you know if you want to know more about it about lotus birth uh send me an email I the person that are that really brought it a little bit back she did research in the Amazon and with indigenous people all over the world and saw how they treat babies you know in a natural way and She wrote a little book about it uh and I can share it with anybody so if you want to read about it uh you know send me an email uh piers mean my name c s as in cranial sacro at gmail dot com and I'll send you the book you can read about it calls it a Shakra.

59:28 - Anna Esparham

Wow. Okay. Oh wow, so interesting. I, there's some stuff on that I've been reading about and they're kind of speculating here and there, so that'd be interesting to learn, more cool.

1:00:04 - Etienne Peirsman

Yeah, so that's, that's part of the book plots, Yeah, so many more, about the classes, about, no mind about anything.

1:00:15 - Anna Esparham

But that's one of your main, you know, teachings, is trying to get into that.

1:00:19 - Etienne Peirsman

yeah,

1:00:19 - Anna Esparham

Sp

1:00:19 - Etienne Peirsman

oh yeah, oh yeah. And you know, in the baby class, that's one of the things we do in the baby class, you know, you learn how to deal with babies, how to treat babies, how to treat small children, but it's also a resetting of your own birthing process. We go through a whole birding rebirth and a burning process and also, you know, reclaiming that lost energy, placenta energy, it's a whole process. It takes about two days, you know, on the table that we go through, through a total reset of your own system.

1:01:04 - Etienne Peirsman

And how to reclaim Lost energy?

1:01:06 - Anna Esparham

cool. Yeah, I've heard people doing that and it's been very helpful for them. Okay, awesome. Well, I'm so happy, I learned so much from you today. Thank you so much. Atn. After, after I do my residency, we'll have to come back and do something else.

1:01:26 - Etienne Peirsman

All right.

1:01:26 - Anna Esparham

Well, Thanks for being on the show today